I''ve found a place to get slightly older versions of some commercial graphics - might be useful to folks here on a budget. 3D World magazine is a monthly mag that comes from England somewhere- it''s pricey for a magazine ($15.00 US or so) but each issue has a CD, usually with an older graphics app, or a demo of a current product. Last month they included Amapi v4.15 (current is v5 I think), this month it has an older version of Vue D''esprit (sp?). Usu has a bunch of smaller things too (textures, or filters, or whatnot).